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msilverstar

The RPF/RPS issue

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Mar. 22nd, 2005 | 10:41 pm
mood: bemused
music: some kinda jazz from itunes across the room

There's a thoughtful mostly pro-RPS discussion in fanthropology. There are anti-RPS discussions as well, but I am not bothering to link to them.

I came into fanfic via LOTRiPS. If viva_gloria wasn't such a fabulous writer, I don't think I'd be here. She seduced me and I'm glad she did. Before that, I was squicked by the idea of Kirk/Spock, and still don't read much FPS. For me, RPS is the norm. Plus, hey, I write het too, so the "omg it's so awful to say they're gay" doesn't apply to those stories. Are het stories equally "awful"? Are we assuming that all actors are straight and easily offended?

My position comes down to three things:
  1. I write (and read) fiction. I know the difference between stories and reality. I trust the rest of you to do so as well.

  2. Stories about Real People abound in literature. Think of Shakespeare's many historical plays! mimesere and commenters have posted great examples of RPF in the media, from Backbeat to South Park, Mommie Dearest to The Three Musketeers (with a mention of Ed Wood, classic slash!), and Gods and Monsters to The Titanic.

  3. Sean Astin said, at C4, in answer to a question about the internet that he interpreted as about the "homosexual stuff": there are other things online, some people do this stream of consciousness stuff, they have pairings. It's all right, as long as they're not hurting anyone, there's nothing wrong with that. If anyone was likely to freak about RPS, it seemed like it would be him. Thank you, Sean!
Back to your irregularly scheduled smut now. (Whee! I wrote est!Billy/Rachel Weisz romance with unstealthy, they are so cute together.)

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Comments {24}

(Deleted comment)

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from: karadin
date: Mar. 23rd, 2005 03:33 pm (UTC)
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Pardon me for dropping in, I wondered how it started that interest in RPS = stalking. I write about Elijah Wood as a character, it is fiction. I have no intention of finding out where he lives and spending my time following him around.

Anyone can be a stalker, plently of people who become fixed on actors, blurring the lines between character and real person do not write fic. I'm pissed off that RPS writers become lumped into this category. (not that I think that you are saying that here, you are speaking of yourself, but it's popped up in a lot of 'dicussions' I've seen online.

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Lotripper

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from: msilverstar
date: Mar. 23rd, 2005 05:04 pm (UTC)
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I think lin is saying she worries that RPS would feed her obsession with a particular actor, which might turn into stalking. I read it as more a personal thing for her than an indightment of RPS.

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from: karadin
date: Mar. 23rd, 2005 06:27 pm (UTC)
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Yeah, but it's showing up on other discussions, I just wonder why they get lumped togetha, is all. How could someone consider an RPS fic as reality?

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(Deleted comment)

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from: karadin
date: Mar. 24th, 2005 03:54 am (UTC)
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Of course just for discussion. Are you a writer yourself? Is this why you believe that your internal world view is more at risk when reading fantasy, because you want to believe it? When I was young I used fantasy to escape, but I turned that motivation into writing stories and drawing pictures. As the creator, with control over my characters and the world they were in, I could not confuse reality and fantasy, as msilverstar writes, it's a great way to deal with conflicts and get out a lot of energy.

I never say that celebrities are not real people, they do deserve our respect, which is why I do not copy stalker/paparzzi pictures, I do not join message boards or groups that speculate about the actors private lives, and I would never claim to write something 'real'.

RPS is only another form of fiction. Nothing in it is true, disclaimers are there for a reason. I just wondered why stalking and writing RPS fic are combined, when I know plenty of people who exhibit 'stalking' behavoir toward Elijah Wood who only write FPS and are in fact, enamored of Frodo, not the actor himself.

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Lotripper

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from: msilverstar
date: Mar. 23rd, 2005 05:02 pm (UTC)
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I totally respect your right to avoid RPS like the plague. If it's wrong for you, it's wrong. I didn't get photo ops with the hobbit guys at ORC because that blurred my particular border. I like them up on stage, consciously choosing what to disclose. I don't really want to connect on a personal level. Other people do and that's OK with me.

I myself can't read LOTR FPS slash or Aubrey/Maturin because I read the books long before I read slash, and my reading of them is quite un-slashy. PotC on the other hand, is fair game for me, given the way they filmed it and the way I watched it.

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Pippin's Peach

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from: pippinspeach
date: May. 4th, 2005 07:47 pm (UTC)
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If you find yourself on the verge of, say, throwing those zines away, let me know. I'll give you my address, because I'd love to read them. :)

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(Deleted comment)

Lotripper

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from: msilverstar
date: Mar. 23rd, 2005 05:10 pm (UTC)
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Well, Sean's statement is both moderate and accurate. Even if he thinks RPS is "somewhat inappropriate," that's OK with me, he's not freaking out, just being uncomfortable, and who can blame him? I suspect he's thinking more of Theban Band and other manips, which are pretty hard to ignore.

And no way is he upset about SANet! It's a great site, far better than his official one. I bet he boasts about it to other actors.

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the agony and the irony, they're killing me

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from: sophrosyne31
date: Mar. 23rd, 2005 01:42 pm (UTC)
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You know, Avi, I don't really ever read the Establishment -- too much stuff, no time. But I read this bit and oh, it's so lovely! gentle flirting & embarrassment and a courtly nervous Billy. I don't know which of you wrote which bit or how the whole thing works, but I want to thank you for enticing me into the Est. even just only for a minute

<3

Also, with you on the RPS. We're not idiots. We have done some thinking. We can be responsible for ourselves.

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Lotripper

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from: msilverstar
date: Mar. 23rd, 2005 05:12 pm (UTC)
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Oh thank you sweetie! I have a hard time pushing my fic, and get very little fb on the RPS, and cherish your appreciation! I write Billy.

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the agony and the irony, they're killing me

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from: sophrosyne31
date: Mar. 24th, 2005 02:33 am (UTC)
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I miss your fic!! is it all in RPS? i'm scared of RPS fic! i loved your billy!

*bounces*

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Lotripper

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from: msilverstar
date: Mar. 24th, 2005 03:16 am (UTC)
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Lately, yeah, pretty much all RPG or collaborative writing. Mostly est!Miranda and hkverse and restarting est!Billy.

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Not a Ninja

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from: unstealthy
date: Mar. 27th, 2005 04:46 pm (UTC)
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Wow, what lovely feedback! msilverstar writes Billy so well, I'm having loads of fun writing with her.

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the agony and the irony, they're killing me

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from: sophrosyne31
date: Mar. 28th, 2005 02:41 pm (UTC)
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i really liked the story, you may have tempted me to read more, yes. *blinks*

*firm nod*

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from: karadin
date: Mar. 23rd, 2005 03:31 pm (UTC)
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How does liking and writing RPs become stalking behavior? I write about Elijah Wood as a character, it is fiction. I have no intention of finding out where he lives and spending my time following him around.

Anyone can be a stalker, plently of people who become fixed on actors, blurring the lines between character and real person do not write fic. I'm pissed off that RPS writers become lumped into this category.

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Lotripper

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from: msilverstar
date: Mar. 23rd, 2005 05:15 pm (UTC)
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I sometimes feel a bit stalker-ish, knowing where various actors live, what they're working on at the moment, and the names of their friends and families. So I can see that there could be an overlap between RPS-writers and stalkers. Maybe it's a release to write about them instead of obsessing about the real people in real life. They're far more cooperative in fic!

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from: karadin
date: Mar. 23rd, 2005 06:30 pm (UTC)
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So true!

Now if Frodo would just .... stay ... at one address ...*pulls out map*

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(Deleted comment)

Lotripper

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from: msilverstar
date: Mar. 24th, 2005 03:17 am (UTC)
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Anyone could. I wouldn't, if I didn't write RPS. That's all.

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missmolly9

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from: missmolly9
date: Mar. 23rd, 2005 04:34 pm (UTC)
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All great points! Well said.

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Lotripper

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from: msilverstar
date: Mar. 23rd, 2005 05:15 pm (UTC)
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thanks, I appreciate that!

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Lotripper

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from: msilverstar
date: Mar. 26th, 2005 10:18 pm (UTC)
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Yeah, I think it's good to think about boundaries and be quite clear about teaching newcomers to respect privacy. I suspect that's where some of the problems are: when someone discovers fandom and slash and just can't keep their excitement bottled up. So we have to say, explicitly, every so often, "let's leave them alone."

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Anonymity as a Refuge

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from: mirabile_dictu
date: Mar. 25th, 2005 07:21 am (UTC)
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You're writing Billy again! Do you know how happy this makes me? Really really really happy! Thank you. I enjoyed him with Rachel (who is a cutie-pie), but I really liked the one set in the airplane loo; it really tickled me that that last line was Elijah's.

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Lotripper

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from: msilverstar
date: Mar. 26th, 2005 10:20 pm (UTC)
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Thank you so much sweetie. Making you happy is in fact one of my goals in fandom :-) The wanking one was so easy to write, it was like channeling him, only of course, not. The last line was mine, and I didn't feel like finding a Scottish or UK equivalent, so I just used Elijah. :-)

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Anonymity as a Refuge

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from: mirabile_dictu
date: Mar. 26th, 2005 10:44 pm (UTC)
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Making you happy is in fact one of my goals in fandom

Now that is a worthy goal, one I think the entire LOTR RPS fandom should adopt :)

More seriously, I didn't comment on the main point of your post because I'm still thinking about it. Even though I write RPS, I'm still pretty uncomfortable with it. I conceptualize what I do as cyber-stalking the actors' public personae. But as you know, I have absolutely no desire for any kind of RL contact with them. In fact, as at ORC, I actually avoid it. But somehow that doesn't comfort me. I still feel quite stalkerish.

Anyway, thanks for the post and giving me even more the ponder as I figure out just what the hell I'm doing writing and reading this stuff.

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Not a Ninja

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from: unstealthy
date: Mar. 27th, 2005 04:44 pm (UTC)
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Thank you so much for the fb, it's nice to know people are reading! They are lovely together, aren't they? And I thought the bit in the loo was so very, very hot. Guh.

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