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msilverstar

LJ doesn't want us. Time to make other plans.

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Aug. 3rd, 2007 | 08:14 pm
mood: grumpy
music: stuck outside of Lodi with those Memphis blues again

I've come to believe that LJ doesn't want to deal with sexuality and those parts of fandom that are sexually explicit. They'd rather do sponsorship deals with Pepsi and Citibank. and sell the attention of their users. Anything that would scare off corporations is simply not worth it to them, despite all the financial support they've had from fandom over the years.

They don't want us any more. The only power we have is as consumers, the power to take our money elsewhere. It's time to start. I'm cross-posting everything from now on, and making new communities on other journals. I bought a permanent InsaneJournal account ($30, why not) and will be happy to make syndicated feeds from LJ journals and comms. I'm going to support fan efforts to make new systems of community and archives that we can never lose. This is why:
  • Despite all assurances that the Abuse Team would warn people of any problems with their content, and allow them to make changes, at least two fan artists have been summarily booted off of LJ. Their journals and scrapbooks are inaccessible, their posts everywhere are removed, not just for the offending journal, but for other journals with the same email contact address. This includes paid and permanent journals. And to add insult to injury, their names aren't even marked with a strike -- so ponderosa121 and elaboration just look... weird.

  • LJ user stormcloude got a response to her question about the rationale for deleting the journals. It comes down to a self-selected and anonymous group of LJ staffers and Abuse Team members making judgments about whether the artistic seriousness of the work outweighs the sexual nature. FOR THE LOSE.

  • As of now, I'm boycotting the term "suspended" -- if a journal is suddenly and permanently removed, that's "deleted by LJ". Suspended generally means a temporary thing.

  • Remember when I said they'd add a "report abuse" button to every post? They're doing it now. It's a link at the bottom next to "Be a Support Volunteer"

  • And while we're at it: paid users now get to see ads, if they're sponsored by corporations (Pepsi, wow) the form of moods or journal styles. And get this: they're animated, so if you're like me, you'll hate them intensely. Firefox tip: press the Escape key after the page loads and all animations will stop.

  • OMG, it goes on... LJ has warned a deleterious commentator (laughing at badfic, like Mystery Science Theater) that they must remove their post due to a copyright complaint. A HP fic author claimed copyright on her stuff was being violated (fair use, everyone!), and the only way the OP can deal with it is to file a counter-claim which will disclose their name and address.


  • elaboration's posts about being deleted: 1, 2, 3. She doesn't draw underage sex, she drew adult Weasly twins wanking each other. ponderosa121 who has drawn underage sex, has some thoughts on being deleted. zenfu, who does shota art, was also deleted, and misses his/her friends.

  • synecdochic (who ETA used to work for LJ and is also a fan) blames US law for all this. No mention of warnings. No comments allowed.

  • Useful communities: Fandom Directory on IJ, fandom_tossed on GJ innocence_jihad on LJ, 07refugees on IJ

  • How to syndicate journals to to multiple services

  • elke_tanzer has some great thoughts about what to do next. The most unexpected one -- make sure all communities have multiple moderators in case one gets deleted.

  • shaggirl has a list of alternate journaling systems, also a poll on fan support for a new system

  • almostnever has directions for mass-adding friends on any LJ-clone system

  • fandom_flies is a LJ community to coordinate all efforts to try to create a LJ-clone run by fans for fans.

  • twocorpses is starting an LJ clone

  • rahalia suggests signing up at the Directorium wiki.




ETA: one last good link: shushu addresses objections to leaving LJ
Wow this sucks. I'm msilverstar.greatestjournal.com and msilverstar.insanejournal.com and msilverstar.journalfen.net. See you there.

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Comments {35}

dragonkal

(no subject)

from: dragonkal
date: Aug. 4th, 2007 03:41 am (UTC)
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I've come to believe that LJ doesn't want to deal with sexuality and those parts of fandom that are sexually explicit.

I see no indication of this. I won't go arguing my points because they're in my LJ if you care to see them.

I'm not going anywhere.

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Lotripper

(no subject)

from: msilverstar
date: Aug. 4th, 2007 03:56 am (UTC)
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OK. Your choice.

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Capra Maritimus

(no subject)

from: capra_maritimus
date: Aug. 4th, 2007 03:41 am (UTC)
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I bought my insane journal permanent account yesterday.

*sigh*

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Lotripper

(no subject)

from: msilverstar
date: Aug. 4th, 2007 03:59 am (UTC)
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*clings*

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Anonymity as a Refuge

(no subject)

from: mirabile_dictu
date: Aug. 4th, 2007 03:45 am (UTC)
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I completely agree. It's time to go. I wish we had a non-LJ clone to go to, but since we don't, it's IJ for me.

*clings*

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Lotripper

(no subject)

from: msilverstar
date: Aug. 4th, 2007 04:00 am (UTC)
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Yeah. But despite the fragmentation of threads problem, LJ-code is the best conferencing system I've ever used. So off to IJ.

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Still learning to be me

(no subject)

from: canciona
date: Aug. 4th, 2007 03:50 am (UTC)
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Just a quick note: it appears that synecdochic actually doesn't work for LJ, as of last week.

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Lotripper

(no subject)

from: msilverstar
date: Aug. 4th, 2007 04:00 am (UTC)
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Thanks for the correction, I've changed it in text.

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londo mollari

(no subject)

from: machiavellian
date: Aug. 4th, 2007 04:04 am (UTC)
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Haha of course after I buy my permanent IJ account, the site goes down. LIFE.

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Lotripper

(no subject)

from: msilverstar
date: Aug. 4th, 2007 04:07 am (UTC)
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we're overwhelming it, killing it with attention. ah well, it will cope or fail.

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blink back to let me know

(no subject)

from: bunniewabbit
date: Aug. 4th, 2007 06:53 am (UTC)
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I'm tempted to hit a couple hundred random entries and click the "Report Abuse" button on every one of them just to piss them off, but I know that it will only get me in trouble in the long run.

A HP fic author claimed copyright on her stuff was being violated

Um... what? What about her violation of JKR's copyright? Not that I think that's valid, either, but come on!

Firefox tip: press the Escape key after the page loads and all animations will stop.

I haven't even seen these ads, yet. What pages do they appear on? Another Firefox tip: ADBLOCK. I suspect that is the reason why I've not been subjected to these ads.

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Lotripper

(no subject)

from: msilverstar
date: Aug. 4th, 2007 04:28 pm (UTC)
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I know, though technically everything written is presumed to have copyright. But the hypocrisy of it of it is staggering!

The ads are in journal themes: http://www.livejournal.com/customize/themes.bml?layout=8743588 and mood themes: http://www.livejournal.com/moodlist.bml?moodtheme=333551. Prepare for corporate advertising...

I adore adblock, it's why I can stand InsaneJournal!

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heels and pints

(no subject)

from: birdgerhl
date: Aug. 4th, 2007 07:50 am (UTC)
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A HP fic author claimed copyright on her stuff was being violated
i'd bet good money on that being the funniest thing i will hear all day.

whilst there's no doubt that lj are being heavy-handed and there have been peeps caught in the cross-fire here, in the main i don't have an awful lot of sympathy or time for this. i'd be quite happy if all the shota/wanking weasley twins/underage h***y p****r crap vanished from lj forever.

like a previous commenter, i don't think that lj is specifically targeting fandom, or sex(uality)-related content (at least, not at the moment). imho, people have been far too careless about what has been posted/"advertised" via interests and the like, and in many cases have responded to being warned off with astonishing arrogance - lj has no obligation to host this content, or any other type of content for that matter. synecdochic's post is an excellent one - hardly any of the outraged parties seemed to have taken a moment to really consider how their creations might be viewed by the wider world outside lj. moreover, US law (which, i assume, applies to lj and its content, regardless of the location of the journal owner) makes its position on "child pornography" quite clear - at least as regards visual material.

that said, i do have a greatestjournal - whilst i no longer have any interest in fandom, i would still want to connect with people on a personal level.

b.x :)

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Lotripper

(no subject)

from: msilverstar
date: Aug. 4th, 2007 04:29 pm (UTC)
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I'm not necessarily defending the content, though have seen some and it's mostly adult and consensual. But LJ's attitude towards paying customers is awful, and I don't trust them to be nice to me.

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nerdy secret bondage pixie

(no subject)

from: impasto
date: Aug. 4th, 2007 08:26 am (UTC)
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I'm staying here, for various reasons, but I respect the decision to move away, and you'll find me at GJ, IJ, and JF as impasto. I'll keep tabs on those flists so I don't lose touch, but I don't expect to update those journals, unless I figure out the whole Semagic thing. :)

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Lotripper

(no subject)

from: msilverstar
date: Aug. 4th, 2007 04:29 pm (UTC)
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I don't intend to lose you, I'm just refusing to be held captive by a company that likes Pepsi better than paying customers.

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(Deleted comment)

Lotripper

(no subject)

from: msilverstar
date: Aug. 4th, 2007 04:37 pm (UTC)
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For archiving, I use a combination of xJournal's post history and emails of comments. You could use the LJBook service as well.

Mac users are outta luck on the migration. I have a trusted friend who uses LJArchive for me, and I can use that to transfer -- I may well do that.

A web site's a good idea. It can be really simple!

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(Deleted comment)

the baby of the family

(no subject)

from: knowledgequeen
date: Aug. 4th, 2007 03:07 pm (UTC)
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I normally concur with your position - LJ does seem incredibly unsympathetic to fandom, and I do think that fandom is being targeted indiscriminately. But I don't have a lot of sympathy for the fan artists' being deleted. I'm sorry, I don't.

Don't get me wrong - I have all the sympathy in the world for the fact that they didn't get a chance to save their work (though I hope they have it on their hard drives!), but in today's climate, you have to adapt. The days where you can post unlocked underage-or-close-to-it porn in a community that apparently doesn't really age-check (correct me if I'm wrong) are over, and frankly, I'm glad. I'm in a fandom that basically promotes incest, and while I have a problem with it morally, it's not illegal in a lot of states. Child porn is illegal, and with the current state of US obscenity law, private companies and the courts have an incredible amount of sway in defining it.

I do have a gj - I think you have me friended already - but to me, there's a difference between this stuff and the crap they pulled with WfI. I'm still not giving 6A my money, but I no longer see any reason to run away. And I'll miss you if you do. :D

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Lotripper

(no subject)

from: msilverstar
date: Aug. 4th, 2007 04:40 pm (UTC)
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I'm not necessarily defending the content, though have seen some and it's mostly adult and consensual. But LJ's attitude towards paying customers is awful, and I don't trust them to be fair to me.

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Brilliant...but not Gifted

(no subject)

from: iolanthe_rosa
date: Aug. 4th, 2007 07:59 pm (UTC)
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This is so interesting! It just so happens I'm on lunch break from a class on IP rights (copyright, trademark and patent), and we just finished a discussion of on-line fan fiction. (bottom line: no big deal as long as no money's being made.)

I completely, 100% support any consumer, like you, who wants to vote with your pocketbook/feet because your vendor is not making you happy as a customer, for whatever reason. That's every consumer's right, and often the only way to get one's point across.

What I shake my head at are the folks who are trying to frame this as a freedom of speech/artistic expression issue. Live Journal is under no First Amendment obligation to protect a subscriber's right to publish fan fiction. They're a private provider, and they get to make the rules.

I was just reading an interesting post at An Internet researcher/PhD candidate at Cal" about class divisions and social networking sites. I think Live Journal is going through a class, or maybe a subculture, shift right of as-yet-undefined scope, for the purpose of shoring up their branding. I'm just sort of watching it all happen around me. I have no intention of leaving LJ at the moment.

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Lotripper

(no subject)

from: msilverstar
date: Aug. 4th, 2007 10:31 pm (UTC)
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I am so glad to hear that there's no overwhelming legal case against fanfic! The conclusion seems very common-sensical. That does put a sock in FanLib though, if the IP rights begin where there's money involved.

LiveJournal is not required to allow all kinds of free speech, but they really ought to be more clear about their own rules. It's nasty to customers to be so vague and the consequences of breaking the rules so arbitrary and complete.

That thing about MySpace vs. Facebook is interesting, though the lines on both are blurring as MySpace becomes ubiquitous and Facebook allows non-students to join. I think that LJ/6A is having one of those moments, and I think they're dumb because they'll never be MySpace and they're trading cash in the hand for sponsorship in the bush. Corporations have no loyalty: if LJ doesn't deliver, the'll be out in the street. But there you go, the management is unclear on concept and we all suffer.

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elychari

(no subject)

from: elychari
date: Aug. 5th, 2007 09:02 pm (UTC)
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a copyright complaint can only be done by a copyright holder. do you think it was JKR Rowling pressed the complaint button?

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Lotripper

(no subject)

from: msilverstar
date: Aug. 6th, 2007 03:01 am (UTC)
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I think there's an unclear copyright issue here, as under the Berne copyright convention all published work (including electronic publishing and blogs) is copyrighted by default, although it's easier to enforce if publishers file a statement at the Copyright Office.

If derivative works like fanfic are legal (as per bunniwabbit's comment above), they might be protected by copyright.

But the copyright law is pretty clear that reviews (even deletrious sporkings) fall into the "fair use" exemption.

So basically, LJ/6A chose to put the onus on the poster rather than the complainant. Which sucks.

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V. Wishes

(no subject)

from: viciouswishes
date: Aug. 5th, 2007 09:23 pm (UTC)
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Oh, fannish entitlement.

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Lotripper

(no subject)

from: msilverstar
date: Aug. 6th, 2007 03:02 am (UTC)
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I disagree, but I'm not interested in arguing with summary dismissal, so I'm freezing this thread.

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